Black Stork Webcam Discussion 2009

Cameras Watching over Black Storks nest
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yarko
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Re: Black Stork Webcam Discussion 2009

Post by yarko »

yarko wrote:Liis you should go to Estonia! We have plenty of mushrooms this year - whatever kind you like! :D!
Liis said: So there were here. But all the interesting ones have disappeared. So Urmas Tartes' strategy of giving red mushrooms when there are no red roses would be very difficult (but plenty of red roses flowering!).
But it is really like a detective story - the nettles, mushrooms etc. clues to where Padis has been.
PS. Yarko, you forgot the ants in the camera
Liis i haven't heard about that strategy - giving red mushrooms! Sounds clever! Forgot about ants! :D

Speaking about plants ...Wait a minute. Could it be idea for new cam? Put various seeds in the ground and observe plants growing. :whistling: No hurries in taking snapshots - plenty of time to choose the right moment. Possibility to give them names, create a special bond with them... :rolleyes:
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Post by Liis »

yarko wrote: Liis i haven't heard about that strategy - giving red mushrooms! Sounds clever! Forgot about ants! :D

Speaking about plants ...Wait a minute. Could it be idea for new cam? Put various seeds in the ground and observe plants growing. :whistling: No hurries in taking snapshots - plenty of time to choose the right moment. Possibility to give them names, create a special bond with them... :rolleyes:
Hmmm - maybe all this ecology & biodiversity should move over to Picnic grounds?
Although as said, we really always keep strictly to topic. Any topic that happens to come around ... :mrgreen:
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Post by Jo UK »

That's right Liis.
I once looked up the meaning of topic.
It is what ever the subject of discussion is at the momennt. So it's not really possible to be "off-topic", theoretically.
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Post by ame »

i love the way the discussion flows freely in all possible directions here... :mrgreen: -the nest became quite a jungle in the end of the season... we'll be waiting here in the spring for the birds! :wave:
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Post by Leica Eagles »

yarko wrote:Hi Leica Eagles (great avatar BTW :rolleyes: ) - Annual Mushroom festival? :shock:
I hesitate to start to ask questions - there are too many of them - but i found a link!
http://www.mushroomfestival.org/
that one?

yes thats the one :wave:
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Post by alice44 »

I wonder if any one has done studies of plant growths in nests, seems like it might be interesting.
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Post by asteria »

I don't think so, 'cause plants can grow only in empty nests not interesting for bird-watchers.
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Post by Liis »

asteria wrote:I don't think so, 'cause plants can grow only in empty nests not interesting for bird-watchers.
In that case - why?
(only in empty nests, that is. AND why birdwatchers sometimes maybe couldn't take an interest in some non-winged biology too ... :mrgreen: :mrgreen: )
Because the birds trample the plants? Plants manage to grow on paths and streets.
Because the bird excrements "burn" the plants? There are patches of fantastic flowers on very stony, very bird-inhabited islands. But true, maybe not in totally fresh "guano".
Because the birds eat them? Sulli & Kluti and the others didn't seem to miss vegetables much - like any other kids.
We will see next spring 8-) - let's hope Urmas the gardener didn't weed too carefully! But true, if plants in bird nests were usual people should have noticed, there ought to be all sorts of tales about "flowers in trees" (hmmm, those hanging gardens of Babylon ...?).
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Post by unp »

A story was published a couple of months ago:

"This year, a sprig of green suddenly appeared one day early in the season. I assumed it was a small conifer twig with needles still attached, and didn’t expect it would stay that way for too long.
"However, the sprig of green got bigger and greener. It was soon obvious that a living plant was growing in the nest...
"The plant continued to get bigger and bushier, and small, white daisy-like flowers appeared. The overall effect was quite decorative and aesthetically pleasing..."

source: http://www.bangordailynews.com/detail/115222.html

Image
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source: http://www.flickr.com/photos/55woodduck/3752418589
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Post by asteria »

Liis wrote: In that case - why?
(only in empty nests, that is. AND why birdwatchers sometimes maybe couldn't take an interest in some non-winged biology too ... :mrgreen: :mrgreen: )
Because the birds trample the plants? Plants manage to grow on paths and streets.
Because the bird excrements "burn" the plants? There are patches of fantastic flowers on very stony, very bird-inhabited islands. But true, maybe not in totally fresh "guano".
Because the birds eat them? Sulli & Kluti and the others didn't seem to miss vegetables much - like any other kids.
We will see next spring 8-) - let's hope Urmas the gardener didn't weed too carefully! But true, if plants in bird nests were usual people should have noticed, there ought to be all sorts of tales about "flowers in trees" (hmmm, those hanging gardens of Babylon ...?).
Just remember how Big, Mid and Little always "attacked" moss Padis brought last year. No chance to survive for any seeds and grass. That is the reason I think.
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Post by Liis »

:2thumbsup: unp!
(How do you find all these things ?!)
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Post by macdoum »

Liis wrote::2thumbsup: unp!
(How do you find all these things ?!)
Unp thats a lovely story and fine pics too.!! :nod: Thank you. Now we have another quest..go and study empty nests. :nod: :shake:(with gardening)
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Post by alice44 »

There was greenery in both Osprey nests here -- not as pretty as in those pictures but... -- and I think at least one of the nests had successful hatching and raising.

I would think the greenery could tell about what the birds were using in their nests and we seem fascinated by the nest greenery ;-)
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Post by unp »

Judging by this diary ( http://www.ospreys.org.uk/Breeding2008B.htm ), overgrown nests can be readily handled by ospreys (ospreys here again! - on the other hand, the osprey thread is occupied by WTEs nowadays):

28th March
"As the photo ... shows, an amazing amount of grass had grown from the centre of the nest - so 03 needed to do plenty of gardening work in preparation for the return of 05."
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4th April
"The photo ... shows the moment 05 landed on the nest after her long flight from West Africa."
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"Spurred into action by the arrival of his mate, 03 continued to nest-build for much of the evening, taking numerous sticks and clumps of turf to the nest. Like 08 in Manton Bay, 03 carried some extremely long sticks to the nest; the one in the photo ... probably measured over six foot in length."
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19th April
"Sure enough, less than three weeks after returning from migration, 05 laid a clutch of eggs."
Image


About a week after the male's return (28th March to 4th April), much of grass was removed (if not simply covered - but the nest doesn't seem to have grown higher); by 19th April, all visible grass was gone.
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Post by Liis »

If this were usual I would still have expected some folk tales of grass & flowers in unused stork nests.
After all, there are all sorts of beliefs and superstitions round trees growing on/in other trees.
Imagine coming into a black stork wood and suddenly there is a circle of flowers - or OK, patch of grain - high up above your head.
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Post by unp »

August 2009
Image
The author titled it "Just Like a Swan" and wrote "Of course I suspected that common herons could swim but saw this for the first time"; key words in comments were: rare, didn't even think, unusual, never seen.

September 2009
http://www.birdphotographers.net/forums ... p?p=345411
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"It is surprising how adapt some unlikely candidates are at swimming. There was an article with photos a couple of years ago showing ptarmigan landing (at taking off) out in the Bering Sea. I've heard of many passerines (warblers and the like) landing out in the Gulf of Mexico during migration. For many of these species swimming is probably not the preferred option but it seems quite a few are capable of it when the need arises."

http://www.birdphotographers.net/forums ... hp?t=33141
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"Many (and probably most) shorebird species swim; I have seen Willet, Marbled Godwit, Greater Yellowlegs, and both dowitchers swimming, usually while having to cross water that is slightly too deep for them while feeding. Yikes, how could I forget American Avocet!"

Discussed and nicely summed up three years earlier: "I did some more research on hobby ornithologists' websites, and there are numerous reports of swimming grey herons. That being said, almost every mention is accompanied by the expression of surprise at seeing such a sight. So it's a common uncommon phenomenon. ---Sluzzelin 16:22, 22 September 2006 (UTC)" (and probably on many other occasions).


'Waders wade not swim', 'birds' nests are meant for eggs and chicks not growing plants' - would 'stereotypes' be the right word? :puzzled: :puzzled: :puzzled: And do storks swim?
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Post by yarko »

WOW - superb pic's unp!!

Hm. Maybe we should find some biologist who would 'enlighten' us in this nests/plants issue? :puzzled:
Anybody knows anybody who knows anybody who knows some biologists?
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Post by Liis »

unp, of course you are right, and precise, as usual: we were a bit careless with usual, normal, frequent, expected, common, ordinary.
Yarko - an acquiantance used to say, No, don't spoil a nice conversation! when somebody offered to look things up. :rolleyes:
We would probably need a folklore person too: have people noticed this, and have they made something out of it? After all, it must be rare and unexpected enough, but still happens.
That it doesn't happen often is, as a guess, because 1) you need a good-sized nest, and one that is used for years (some material breaks down to soil); it helps to have birds who use turf, or muck and clay, or moss 2) plant has to grow very fast from seed / have roots that survive winter up there 3) trampling, fresh excrements, pulling at things (the young birds) and generally a tough growing place might be OK one by one as negative factors , but any or all together are probably too bad. But unused storks' nests - white & black - should be candidates. And osprey nests, obviously.
There is / was a special Swedish word for rowans growing in (on) other trees, "flogrönn".
Yes - do storks swim? Cranes?
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Post by Liis »

Cranes at least seem to swim, even voluntarily
"Although they do not have webbed feet, Cranes can swim quite well, and young birds may often have to swim while following their parents across the wetlands when they are traversing areas too deep for their young legs to allow them to walk
http://www.earthlife.net/birds/cranes.html
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Post by yarko »

Liis said: Yarko - an acquiantance used to say, No, don't spoil a nice conversation! when somebody offered to look things up. :rolleyes:
That was good Liis :laugh:
Mhm...yes a bit of mysticism won't hurt. :D

Storks swimming? Don't think so...though they must have an ability to 'take off' from shallow water.
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