Discussion of Hunting

Jo UK · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 1:34 am

This topic is for the discussion of any matters related to hunting. It can be about hunters, about the laws of hunting, the reasons for hunting, and so on.

Maybe a hunter would like to start?

rebane · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 2:13 am

okaskera wrote:

Sorry, it will be in estonian again. I hope someone will translate it.

Head seakaamera vaatajad. Katsun teile järgnevaga tutvustada seakaamera lähiümbrust ja selle ümber toimuvat (peamiselt selleks, et lõpetada ära vingumine jahimeeste ja paugutamise teemal)
Alloleval lingil avaneb pilt, kus on näha see, mida kaamerast näha ei ole.
http://www.okaskera.ee/katse/jahimaja.jpg
Koht, kus kaamera asub, on meie jahiseltsi jahimaja territooriumil. Jahimaja on selline koht, kus kohalikud jahimehed saavad kokku enne ja pärast jahipäeva, peavad koosolekuid, pidusid - näiteks sünnipäevad, jõulud ja muud sellist. Seal juures on mänguväljak lastele, koht kus kala ja liha suitsutada, palli mängida ja palju muudki. Lisaks on seal valmistatud ohutu koht, kus saab iga mees proovida oma relva, et vältida halvasti laskmist ja loomade ilmaasjata vigastamist.

Jahimehed ei ole seakaamera juures ainult selleks, et seal hoolega sigu sööta, neil on ka rida muid kohustusi nagu näiteks jahipidamine. Jahimeestel on leping Eesti vabariigiga (maavalitsuse läbi) millega on määratud lisaks paljudele muudele asjadele ka küttimismaht, mis TULEB TÄITA. Seega ei ole jahipidamine mitte ainult saamahimu ega verejanu. Küttimismahud määratakse eraldi igale loomaliigile vastavalt loomade loendustele.

Soovist Teile kõigile siiski vaatamisrõõmu pakkuda, oleme me katsunud vältida jahipidamist kaamera läheduses nii palju, kui vähegi võimalik. Vaikse ilmaga, nagu täna, kostavad kõikvõimalikud hääled, püssipaugud, meeste hõiked väga kaugele. Iga pauk, mis kostab ei ole jahipidamine.
Palun mõistmist ja rahu, kui vahepeal on kaamerast kuulda või ka näha midagi muud, kui linnulaul ja tegutsevad metsloomad.

Ok I tried to translate

To the watchers of Pig-TV. I will now try to describe the surrounding view and happenings around the pig camera (mainly to stop the whining about hunters and gunshots).
The following link will show what the camera doesn't
http://www.okaskera.ee/katse/jahimaja.jpg

The Pig-TV camera is on the land near hunting lodge. The hunting lodge is a place where local hunters gather before and after the day's hunting. It's a place to have meetings and parties for example birthdays, christmas etc. Next to it is: a playground for children, a place to smoke meat and fish, a playing field etc. There is also a safe place where the hunters can test their weapons to avoid a bad shot causing the animals to suffer.

The hunters are not there just to feed the pigs, they also have many other tasks and responsibilities (like hunting). Hunters have a contract with the The Republic of Estonia that, amongst other things, limits their hunting including minimum number of kills which MUST BE OBSERVED. Because of that the hunting is not only greed or bloodthirst. Every type of prey has a different hunting limit what is set according to their population.

Because of your viewing pleasure we have tried to avoid hunting near the camera as much as possible. The voices and gunshots travel far on a quiet day like today. Every shot is not from the hunting.
I ask for your understanding and patience if you hear or see anything else except animals and birds on the camera.

The text on the picture:

Jahimaja - hunting lodge
Puukuur - woodshed
söödakuur kus hoitakse metsanotsude toitu - a shed where the food for the pigs is kept
Lasketiir, kus proovitakse relvi ja oma laskeoskust - shooting range where to test your shooting abilities and try out guns
Selle torni taga on kaamera - the camera is behind that tower

Freiya · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 2:16 am

I have little summer-house in little small on the island Hiiumaa. There are lot of wild boars on the island and local people are sometimes very angry, that hunters don´t hunt them enough, because boars come to the farmyard, eat the potatoes, apples... all food reserve for the winter. Fences don´t stop them.I have seen wild board in my yard several times.I usually buy some potatoes frrom my neighbour, when I visit my summer-house, but this year he said, that boars have eaten all, they don´t have to sell me.

tirtsik · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 2:17 am

Freiya I know what are you talking about :) My parents live in Hiiumaa...one summer boars were about 15 m from house and dog- and they didn't care, eat peacefully potatoes... but I know (from personal contacts) hunters are trying to deal with this problem...

terrytvgal · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 2:56 am

Thank you for the translation, rebane. It was very clear.

Ricky · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 2:23 pm

Hello Jasmijn and all other members!
Jasmijn, as far as I know, you live in the Netherlands, where hunting is severely limited. As a result there had been too many animals, e. g. geese. When a population of animals has grown too high it would be obvious to call hunters because the animals which are shot can be eaten. I think you don´t know what happened in the Netherlands than but I´ll tell you: They didn´t call hunters. But they caught the flightless geese during moult and gassed (!!!) them. Actually that are methods like in concentration camps! In addition low fences were installed. They were so low that adult goose could jump over them but the chicks couldn´t. Then they were caught and killed, too. Now you can decide yourself what is better. Hunting or that?
The human being is part of nature. He´s not someting special, he´s just one of thousends of species of mammalien. And since the Homo sapies exists he hunts. Hunting was his livelihood. That, of course, has changed. But without hunting the natural balance would be destroyed. On earth there is no live possible without death. If you kill a plant or an animal. If you kill a domestic pig or a wild boar. You have to kill if you want to live. So, tell me, why shouldn´t you eat a wild animal? There´s no reason, I think.
If there was no hunting nobody would care for these amimals as much as hunters do. Hunting is more "giving" than "taking". Hunters try to keep alive a species-rich fauna. Of course to use it. But they would never use it too much. Many animals would die in winter if hunters didn´t feed them.
Well, I could tell you a lot more (maybe some other hunter does?), but my time is not endless.
But I think and hope that you see that hunting is not unnecessary. You are not against hunting itself, I´m sure, you´re against killing animals. I can understand you - of course. Nobody likes to kill and for those who do it isn´t easy. But as written before, you or someone else has to kill if you want to survive.
Best wishes, Ricky

rebane · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 3:21 pm

Ricky wrote:

Hello Jasmijn and all other members!
Jasmijn, as far as I know, you live in the Netherlands, where hunting is severely limited. As a result there had been too many animals, e. g. geese. When a population of animals has grown too high it would be obvious to call hunters because the animals which are shot can be eaten. I think you don´t know what happened in the Netherlands than but I´ll tell you: They didn´t call hunters. But they caught the flightless geese during moult and gassed (!!!) them. Actually that are methods like in concentration camps! In addition low fences were installed. They were so low that adult goose could jump over them but the chicks couldn´t. Then they were caught and killed, too. Now you can decide yourself what is better. Hunting or that?
The human being is part of nature. He´s not someting special, he´s just one of thousends of species of mammalien. And since the Homo sapies exists he hunts. Hunting was his livelihood. That, of course, has changed. But without hunting the natural balance would be destroyed. On earth there is no live possible without death. If you kill a plant or an animal. If you kill a domestic pig or a wild boar. You have to kill if you want to live. So, tell me, why shouldn´t you eat a wild animal? There´s no reason, I think.
If there was no hunting nobody would care for these amimals as much as hunters do. Hunting is more "giving" than "taking". Hunters try to keep alive a species-rich fauna. Of course to use it. But they would never use it too much. Many animals would die in winter if hunters didn´t feed them.
Well, I could tell you a lot more (maybe some other hunter does?), but my time is not endless.
But I think and hope that you see that hunting is not unnecessary. You are not against hunting itself, I´m sure, you´re against killing animals. I can understand you - of course. Nobody likes to kill and for those who do it isn´t easy. But as written before, you or someone else has to kill if you want to survive.
Best wishes, Ricky

They kill them by gas??? :rant:

But that is soo cruel. What do they do with the meat?? I don't think it can be used afterwards. If they are killed then they should be eaten. Otherwise it is just a waste and a pointless kill. People should respect the animals. :rant:

Jo UK · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 3:23 pm

Thank you Ricky. That is a valuable contribution to this discussion.

I saw that Simon has posted something about hunters and their love of nature and animals, but it was a very short post. It would be good to read more of his opinions too.
Please can you let him know about this new topic? Thanks.

I am looking forward to the time when we can submit questions to Tiit Randla - hunter and eagle feeder!

Jasmijn · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 4:03 pm

rebane wrote:

Ricky wrote:

Hello Jasmijn and all other members!
Jasmijn, as far as I know, you live in the Netherlands, where hunting is severely limited. As a result there had been too many animals, e. g. geese. When a population of animals has grown too high it would be obvious to call hunters because the animals which are shot can be eaten. I think you don´t know what happened in the Netherlands than but I´ll tell you: They didn´t call hunters. But they caught the flightless geese during moult and gassed (!!!) them. Actually that are methods like in concentration camps! In addition low fences were installed. They were so low that adult goose could jump over them but the chicks couldn´t. Then they were caught and killed, too. Now you can decide yourself what is better. Hunting or that?
The human being is part of nature. He´s not someting special, he´s just one of thousends of species of mammalien. And since the Homo sapies exists he hunts. Hunting was his livelihood. That, of course, has changed. But without hunting the natural balance would be destroyed. On earth there is no live possible without death. If you kill a plant or an animal. If you kill a domestic pig or a wild boar. You have to kill if you want to live. So, tell me, why shouldn´t you eat a wild animal? There´s no reason, I think.
If there was no hunting nobody would care for these amimals as much as hunters do. Hunting is more "giving" than "taking". Hunters try to keep alive a species-rich fauna. Of course to use it. But they would never use it too much. Many animals would die in winter if hunters didn´t feed them.
Well, I could tell you a lot more (maybe some other hunter does?), but my time is not endless.
But I think and hope that you see that hunting is not unnecessary. You are not against hunting itself, I´m sure, you´re against killing animals. I can understand you - of course. Nobody likes to kill and for those who do it isn´t easy. But as written before, you or someone else has to kill if you want to survive.
Best wishes, Ricky

They kill them by gas??? :rant:

But that is soo cruel. What do they do with the meat?? I don't think it can be used afterwards. If they are killed then they should be eaten. Otherwise it is just a waste and a pointless kill. People should respect the animals. :rant:

I'm sorry Ricky, but you are wrong (fortunattely!) there where plans of gassing the geese (that was in the region 'Noord-Holland') but thousands of people where protesting by the local government against it, so it did not happend.
I know very well what happens in our country, I'm an active member of many nature/animals-protectionprograms.
I live in the country in a very smal village and see many hunters every huntingseason.
I don't like the methods they still use 'beaters', which is illegal here!! and last november they killed many femaile hare's and rabbits and....the only fox that lived here!
(I have chickens, but néver did they steel one, because there was (wild) food enough)
(sometimes when the shot is nót deadly they beat them to dead with long sticks)
I never knew a hare could scream like that :shock:

But móst of all I think that animals are able to adjust to the invironment (little prey, lesser young one's 'too many' rabbits or hare's and they get myxametosis or another disease, lesser prey, lesser eggs and so on)
I will no further take part of this discussion, it's a very sensitive subject to me, but I did not want to be unpolite, so this is how I feel about it, I hope you understand?
Greetings, Jasmijn.

Ricky · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 4:26 pm

Jasmijn, as written before I DO understand you, but your way of thinking is ill-conceived, I think.
1.)If animals die of sickness they also can be shot and eaten!
2.)Not every shoot kills the animal at once. So sometimes the animals screams or have to be killed in an other way than shooting, because the more you shoot on one animal the less of the meat can be eaten.
3.)Geese have been killed like I wrote. There are many links I could post, here´s one (I´m afraid it´s in German language maybe someone will translate it with a translation program? Thank you!): http://www.wild-web.net/wwd/forumneu/th ... bf391dfa1c
And of course the meat can´t be eaten. :rant:

Jasmijn · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 5:08 pm

Ricky wrote:

Jasmijn, as written before I DO understand you, but your way of thinking is ill-conceived, I think.
1.)If animals die of sickness they also can be shot and eaten!
2.)Not every shoot kills the animal at once. So sometimes the animals screams or have to be killed in an other way than shooting, because the more you shoot on one animal the less of the meat can be eaten.
3.)Geese have been killed like I wrote. There are many links I could post, here´s one (I´m afraid it´s in German language maybe someone will translate it with a translation program? Thank you!): http://www.wild-web.net/wwd/forumneu/th ... bf391dfa1c
And of course the meat can´t be eaten. :rant:

Why is the way I think 'ill-conceived'? :puzzled:

1)Why should you wánt shoot animals that are allready sick/dying, what is the nééd of that? (and I think it's not healthy to eat meat from sick animals)
2)I think if anyone is not able to shoot an animal at once, he should not be a hunter in the first place and hitting a hit animal again and again is cruel en shoot be forbidden.
3) Maybee you mean something else, I will look it up/ask my friends who live and work there, but as far as I know did it not happen (legaly)
I don't care if the meat from the geese could or cannot be eaten, it should not be happening.

Ricky · **Posted:** January 4th, 2009, 11:44 pm

Jasmijn wrote:

Ricky wrote:

Jasmijn, as written before I DO understand you, but your way of thinking is ill-conceived, I think.
1.)If animals die of sickness they also can be shot and eaten!
2.)Not every shoot kills the animal at once. So sometimes the animals screams or have to be killed in an other way than shooting, because the more you shoot on one animal the less of the meat can be eaten.
3.)Geese have been killed like I wrote. There are many links I could post, here´s one (I´m afraid it´s in German language maybe someone will translate it with a translation program? Thank you!): http://www.wild-web.net/wwd/forumneu/th ... bf391dfa1c
And of course the meat can´t be eaten. :rant:

Why is the way I think 'ill-conceived'? :puzzled:

1)Why should you wánt shoot animals that are allready sick/dying, what is the nééd of that? (and I think it's not healthy to eat meat from sick animals)
2)I think if anyone is not able to shoot an animal at once, he should not be a hunter in the first place and hitting a hit animal again and again is cruel en shoot be forbidden.
3) Maybee you mean something else, I will look it up/ask my friends who live and work there, but as far as I know did it not happen (legaly)
I don't care if the meat from the geese could or cannot be eaten, it should not be happening.

Hi Jasmijn!
I wrote a bit too fast, so the word "ill-conceived" was too strong, sorry. I mean you should think a bit about your own thinking. :blush:

1.)Sickness is often a result of too high population. So you can shoot and eat them before they are sick. Controlling the number of animal to prevent sickness.
2.)A shoot often can´t kill an animal at once, that´s physics and biology. And then the animal has to be killed as fast as possible. And you can´t shoot in any case.
3.)We (You, mary and me) seem to be informed differently. Everyone thinks (s)he´s right. We don´t know.

Best wishes and no offence
:rolleyes:

Ricky

Simon · **Joined:** January 1st, 2009, 3:22 pm **Posts:** 76

Good morning hunters, have the message received by the hunter chat, I look forward to the topics discussed here can be healing ,,,,,

Waidmannsheil Simon

caysa · **Posted:** January 8th, 2009, 9:47 am

Sorry, my post was not popular..........

terrytvgal · **Posted:** January 8th, 2009, 10:46 am

Happy Eating! That is a lot of good healthy meat.

wayward · **Joined:** January 8th, 2009, 1:33 pm **Posts:** 1

Sickness is often a result of too high population. So you can shoot and eat. Controlling the number of humans to prevent war and sickness? We sure as hell are arrogant creatures...

rebane · **Posted:** January 8th, 2009, 2:27 pm

Yum... good for you, good meat

Kuremari · **Posted:** January 8th, 2009, 6:16 pm

wayward wrote:

Sickness is often a result of too high population. So you can shoot and eat. Controlling the number of humans to prevent war and sickness? We sure as hell are arrogant creatures...

no, you got it all wrong!
someone/something is controlling the number of humans by wars and sickness!

and sorry,you healthy meat people, i just can`t understand the source of your happiness :puzzled:

yarko · **Joined:** October 11th, 2008, 2:40 pm **Posts:** 771

This is my personal opinion and certainly not final truth

I think we should discuss here about hunting's purposes.
Of course hunting is necessary for many reasons.
But there are other, special forums (Hunter's) for presenting hunting trophys.

caysa · **Posted:** January 8th, 2009, 7:34 pm

yarko wrote:

This is my personal opinion and certainly not final truth

I think we should discuss here about hunting's purposes.
Of course hunting is necessary for many reasons.
But there are other, special forums (Hunter's) for presenting hunting trophys.

Did you mean that in this "Discussion of Hunting" it was wrong of me to tell about the deer my husband got???
OK..............
Sorry, I can see that it is not a popular thing.

looduskalender.ee

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