Discussion about donations

Webcam Watching over White-tailed Eagles nest

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Discussion about donations

Post by Jo UK » June 29th, 2016, 11:23 pm

As we are taking up too much page space on the WtE nest topic, I think it best if we continue our "money-talk" posts her. Then we need not feel restricted about posting off-topic.

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Post by Konrad » June 29th, 2016, 11:26 pm

Jo UK, we talked about money raising yesterday. (Sorry for writing a bit off-topic again) I do understand your example of cathedral fund raising very well, because the same has happened in so many services. Just think about the Netscape browser. Everyone having used the web in the 90’s remembers Netscape, which had a user share of about 80-90 % — until Microsoft started to give Internet Explorer free with Windows. You could use also Netscape for free, but you should have paid for it in most cases. Netscape became totally extinct about a decade ago. It is the same thing also with the web versions of newspapers. Some have tried to take payment from readers, but most of them have cancelled the test after the readers have disappeared.

Anyhow, there could be one way to raise money with the video stream and yet keeping the watchers there. For some time ago, Looduskalender made in my opinion a very wise decision to broadcast the WTE stream thru Youtube. They certainly have more server and data transfer capacity to deliver the video all over the world.

Have you discussed the possibility to sell place for a short video ad, which runs every time when someone opens the stream? I do not like ad banners and that’s why I normally have AdBlock on, but the Youtube video ads can normally be bypassed after some seconds, so I do not find them specially annoying. Unfortunately I do not have exact information about the payments you could get from Youtube, but I guess that can be found out if you know the amount of watchers.

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Post by Jo UK » June 29th, 2016, 11:33 pm

I sort of remember Netscape. Maybe I used it a bit, too. Not sure.

Your idea of allowing advertising on the Youtube videos is a good one, but I am not sure that Mr. LK will approve. We can ask webmaster to investigate - if it has not already been considered. As Looduskalender pays for this forum to be ad-free, I wonder how he would feel about ads on a video stream.
The decisions about advertising, or not, rest solely with Looduskalender, not with this forum.

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:18 am

the money-talks began a few days ago on the Estonian WTE-topic. i'll copy the posts from there starting from this post by Jo:
On 26 Jun 2016, 23:43 Jo UK wrote:Members Pirjo & Bosse and RNS have posted about donations so now is a good time for us all to think about showing our appreciation of Looduskalender and Kotkaklubi, the Eagle club.
In the About Us section of this forum we can find descriptions of their work, and details of how to donate to either or both, not forgetting the work of Veterinary specialist, Dr, Madis Leivits.
viewforum.php?f=63

This forum displays a typically European reticence on the subject of asking for money but we have to recognise that not much can be achieved without adequate funding. Volunteer workers do most of the hard work but cameras, equipment, etc, are not free, so if you are feeling generous, please help if you can.
Thank you :bow:
i'll leave this post on the WTE-topic but i'll remove the rest from there after i have copied them here.
viewtopic.php?p=481649#p481649

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:25 am

On 28 Jun 2016, 23:29 Jo UK wrote:I edited Pirjo&Bosse's quoted post about donations, so as to give equal emphasis to the Eagle Club. Those people are responsible for the cameras and equipment through which we are able to have this wonderful experience of seeing and learning about the species in view.
The difference between Kotkaklubi and Looduskalender is not to be described briefly but I can try.

Looduskalender gives us this forum, ad-free and with support. Looduskalender is passionate about education of people in all walks of life, at every age. Through these efforts people become engaged and interested in the natural world - birds, animals. plants etc.
The members of Kotkaklubi are the people who source the cameras, and equipment. They install it, usually in the most difficult conditions - winter - before the birds take up residence in the nest. They ring our birds and record the physical condition of the young, the nest and the environment.
This year, we have seen Urmas and Jurgen climbing tall trees to ring young birds. They are Eagle club members.

So both Looduskalender and Kotkaklubi will welcome any amount, small or large, that you feel you can spare. We each know, as individuals, how much we have benefited from the efforts of LK and KK.
And thank you for raising the subject. :D
i think that i'll keep this post in the WTE-topic, too:
viewtopic.php?p=482649#p482649
On 28 Jun 2016, 23:45 RNS wrote:I love the name Kotkaklubi :D

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:27 am

Pirjo & Bosse wrote:Hi Ghost Ink.
Don´t worry about how much!
We are hundreds of follovers to the WTE-forum, and if each and everyone support with what they can afford - that´ll be MAGIC :2thumbsup:
A lot of volunteers are giving this to us - just because they love the nature. It´s a little offer to give back something...
Come on all visitors: open your wallets. For the best reason you can find!
On 28 Jun 2016, 23:48 Konrad wrote:The only small problem is, that so few people who are watching the video feed find their way to this forum. But of course even we forum members can collect such amounts of money which will be helpful. Calculating from the user record from yesterday: 361 users * 10 euros = 3610 euros. If everyone of us could tranfer at least 10 euros both to Looduskalender and Kotkaklubi, that would be nice. :D
On 28 Jun 2016, 23:51 RNS wrote:Oh I'm planning to donate more :) And they are free to use the money the way they want, I have no demands on more cameras or anything. Just more work for the sake of eagles.

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:30 am

On 28 Jun 2016, 23:58 Jo UK wrote:Konrad, that observation crops up every year. There doesn't seem to be much anyone can do to alter that. Some people are "forum-minded". Some aren't.
I agree - many people giving small amounts would be a wonderful situation.
It has to be a voluntary impulse, though. Here, in Winchester, the Cathedral is always having to raise funds. They even asked for £6 from each visitor/tourist to enter and see the inside of the cathedral. As soon as they announced this "suggested donation" visitor numbers dropped.
When they stopped mentioning money, the donations increased again. The lesson seems to be that we just don't like being asked for money!

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:32 am

Jo UK wrote:I edited Pirjo&Bosse's quoted post about donations, so as to give equal emphasis to the Eagle Club. Those people are responsible for the cameras and equipment through which we are able to have this wonderful experience of seeing and learning about the species in view.
The difference between Kotkaklubi and Looduskalender is not to be described briefly but I can try.
...
So both Looduskalender and Kotkaklubi will welcome any amount, small or large, that you feel you can spare. We each know, as individuals, how much we have benefited from the efforts of LK and KK.
And thank you for raising the subject. :D
On 29 Jun 2016, 08:21 Janne+Ais wrote: Thank you, Jo, for your very clear explanations! Is it possible (or didn't I only find it) to write the donation addresses on the first page of this or even every other (osprey, stork...) thread?
On 29 Jun 2016, 09:03 juta wrote:Jann+Ais

About donations you can find here

viewforum.php?f=63

Kotkaklubi viewtopic.php?f=63&t=509

Looduskalender viewtopic.php?f=63&t=512


Maybe it should be on more visible place but we are not for asking donations on every thread and topic.
On 29 Jun 2016, 12:07 Janne+Ais wrote:Thank you! :thumbs:

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:39 am

On 29 Jun 2016, 10:22 Ambrosius wrote:Donations:
http://www.looduskalender.ee/en/node/3058

I found this page, by following the formerly posted instructions. As links don't open on a new page it's hard to track where you were before. And by entering the board page I could not find it again eather. So, my opinion, please put this link on the most visible place. It is not a crime to ask for funding. I'm sure we all like very much to contribute.

Ofcourse I want to donate and in fact I just did. I hope everyone will follow and express their respect and gratitude. How much we learned these past months? I have been watching daily, and still don't want to lose them out of sight. It was such a strange experience to discover this forum. I had made hundreds of screenshots and there you are with videoclips, highlights, names... a miracle.

To make veryone realise what a great journey we made together, Tuomo posted this compilation. Now I can share with my friends and family.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q02Xuo_IzsE

Greetings from the Netherlands to all of you!!!
With Love,
Marie Louise
On 29 Jun 2016, 10:40 RNS wrote: And not only Looduskalender but Kotkaklubi, too. See the earlier pages, I took their bank details from a post by someone. :gathering:

I have to say that this spring and early summer have changed my world by bringing eagles into by interest list! :loveshower:
On 29 Jun 2016, 11:50 sova wrote:Also I divide the opinion from *Ambrosius*.
If trouble also had to find something.

I owe you all for the wonderful pictures, video, reports. . .
Yes, it is really an enrichment all that are able to do to see. Also the letes year was to be observed already very nicely Durbe and Robert. I must write about the small devil probably nothing. :D It is also to be compared very interesting two nests to her inhabitants.
So to him, I would like to pronounce the Admins, Mods also completely many thanks. :nod:
And numerous members they report day by day. I have learnt already a lot. It may go on so.
In this sense. . . . . THANKS! :thumbs:

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:49 am

On 29 Jun 2016, 13:17 Wuodde wrote:Done. Donation made.
Hope for many to follow...
On 29 Jun 2016, 14:34 Lintinki wrote:Today there was an article in Finnish newspaper ( Keskisuomalainen)about Gennadi Skromnov who is the "father" of Looduskalender-websides. He is very modest person.Altough he mentioned that there's been a lack of money every now and then to keep things rolling.

So I think all donations are more than welcome to make sure we can watch this great reality show in the future too.

Thank you Gennadi :wave:
On 29 Jun 2016, 14:38Jo UK wrote:Lintinki, thank you for that news.
More reason for us to give what we can.

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:53 am

On 29 Jun 2016, 16:05 star-o wrote:My bank in Finland told me they always charge about money transfer abroad. :puzzled: Then I guess all the donations do not go to the right address. :slap: They said that if the Kotkaklubi has a contract with their own bank, it takes the bank fees. In any case, some bank will take a bit. Has Ame or any other some info about this? :shock:

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:55 am

Jo UK wrote:Lintinki, thank you for that news.
More reason for us to give what we can.
On 29 Jun 2016, 16:14 aake wrote:Not as easy as I expected. I have no intention to donate as much as I can, that would necessitate negotiations with children and grandchildren, but I do run into problems when I try to remit a smaller amount.
The banks "MTÜ Fenolo" and "Sampo Pank" are unknown to my bank (Swedbank in Sweden) and I get the information that they might be part of Danske Bank today.
Please, may you give more up to date information, with BIC and IBAN?

Aake
On Jo UK wrote:I will try to find out.
I do know that if your own country is not in the Euro zone, then banks charge an awful amount to make the transfer. I take cash with me when I go to Estonia. If I wanted to donate £20 pounds it would cost me another £25 in bank charges. I thought it was easy enough for transfers between countries who use the Euro currency.
If I can get more information I will post it.
On 29 Jun 2016, 17:17 Jo UK wrote: BIC and IBAN is on the Kotkaklubi topic, in About Us. viewtopic.php?f=63&t=509

KOTKAKLUBI
IBAN: EE182200221040359778
BIC: HABAEE2X
Swedbank AS, 8 Liivalaia Street,15040 Tallinn, Estonia

Looduskalender viewtopic.php?f=63&t=512

MTÜ Fenolo
Postal address: Tehnika 21-8 , Tallinn, EE-10149 Harjumaa, Estonia
Bank: Sampo Pank (SWIFT: FORE EE 2X)

IBAN EE723300333903480009
On 29 Jun 2016, 17:38 Hellem wrote:There must be something wrong with Sampo Pank, since 15.11.2012 it has the name Danske Bank, these requisites are may be obsolete :puzzled:

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 11:58 am

On 29 Jun 2016, 17:21 Felis silvestris wrote:I have sent and paid a lot of things from Germany to Estonia, also in the course of my various trips to Estonia and I never ever paid a single Cent for making a bank transfer from Germany to Estonia. If from UK - maybe take a look into Transferwise -https://transferwise.com/help - another Estonian invention (like Skype). Unfortunately Kotkaklubi still has no PayPal account.
On 29 Jun 2016, 17:56 Medea wrote:There shouldn't be any problems with payments because we are in Single Euro Payments Area. I made payments to other Eurozone countries and was charged same as for national payments.

But I'm not sure how to choose/if one can choose type of costs:
Shared costs (SHA). The costs of the payment will be shared together with the beneficiary. It means that remitter will cover the commission fees of its own bank and beneficiary will cover the costs of the foreign bank.

Costs paid by remitter "no charges to beneficiary" (OUR). Costs of the transaction is paid by remitter. It means that beneficiary will receive the full amount of money that has been transferred.
...
star-o wrote:My bank in Finland told me they always charge about money transfer abroad. :puzzled: Then I guess all the donations do not go to the right address. :slap: They said that if the Kotkaklubi has a contract with their own bank, it takes the bank fees. In any case, some bank will take a bit. Has Ame or any other some info about this? :shock:
On 29 Jun 2016, 17:41 ghost ink wrote:not sure if it helps but how about TransferWise? or similar service?

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:03 pm

On 29 Jun 2016, 18:01 constant.gardener wrote:Hello Jo UK,

I decided to give a donation especially for things to do at WTE nests (ringing, e.g.). Which one do I have to choose, then? Kotkaklubi would be the right one, then?

Thanks in advance
On 29 Jun 2016, 18:07 Jo UK wrote:I have looked at TransferWise - thank you, Felis Silvestris.
I see that my (proposed) donation of £20 - 24.36 Euros will incur a charge of £2, leaving £18 - 21.92 Euros transferred to Kotkaklubi.
As we can't use Paypal for Kotkaklubi then TransferWise is the very best way to donate.
Looduskalender has a Paypal account, which makes life easy for us and them!

Ame. we are using your WtE space to talk money, but it is important!
If the discussion continues to another page we can separate it to a new topic.
:D

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:10 pm

Jo UK wrote:Looduskalender viewtopic.php?f=63&t=512

MTÜ Fenolo
Postal address: Tehnika 21-8 , Tallinn, EE-10149 Harjumaa, Estonia
Bank: Sampo Pank (SWIFT: FORE EE 2X)

IBAN EE723300333903480009
Hellem wrote: There must be something wrong with Sampo Pank, since 15.11.2012 it has the name Danske Bank, these requisites are may be obsolete :puzzled:
On 29 Jun 2016, 18:57 hyypiö wrote:I think it was just change of the name for the bank. At least for me here in Finland when Sampo Pankki became Danske Bank it didn't make any changes for IBAN and BIC. BIC (=SWIFT) FOREEE2X given with Looduskalender (=MTÜ Fenolo) IBAN is valid BIC for DANSKE BANK A/S ESTONIA BRANCH TALLINN ESTONIA. You can check it here: http://www.swift.com/bsl/index.faces

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:11 pm

On 29 Jun 2016, 19:02 Wuodde wrote:I paid with MasterCard through the "DONATE"-button, swift and simple.
On 29 Jun 2016, 19:05 JoUK wrote:I have requested information about any needed update and will post it as soon as I know.

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:13 pm

constant.gardener wrote:Hello Jo UK,

I decided to give a donation especially for things to do at WTE nests (ringing, e.g.). Which one do I have to choose, then? Kotkaklubi would be the right one, then?

Thanks in advance
On 29 Jun 2016, 19:13 Jo UK wrote:If specifically for ringing, then Kotkaklubi can make good use of your donation. Thank you!

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:15 pm

star-o wrote:My bank in Finland told me they always charge about money transfer abroad.
On 29 Jun 2016, 20:28 Konrad wrote:They gave you wrong information. A Finnish bank may not take any fee, when you transfer money to Estonia and the payment is in euros.

The easiest way to make the payment is if you are using Internet banking (=verkkopankki). Just choose a bank transfer (=tilisiirto) and the alternative that you will pay only the fees of your bank. That is pretty confusing said, because choosing the alternative that you will pay the fees of your own bank means in euro payments that you will pay nothing. :laugh: Looduskalender and Kotkaklubi may have to pay some fee for receiving money, but that is in most countries very little, something like 5 or 10 eurocents per payment.

I just made a test payment to Looduskalender and everything went normally. Every member should “test” the transfer by sending 10 euros now. :D
aake wrote:The banks "MTÜ Fenolo" and "Sampo Pank" are unknown to my bank (Swedbank in Sweden) and I get the information that they might be part of Danske Bank today.
On 29 Jun 2016, 20:28 Konrad wrote: MTÜ Fenolo is the name of the organisation behind Looduskalender (and this forum) if I have understood it correctly. It uses Swedbank, the same bank as you. The payment should go quite easily from Swedbank Sweden to Swedbank Estonia.

Sampo Pank does not exist any more. The name is now Danske Bank. That has however no meaning, because you do not need the name of the bank when making a bank transfer. The name and address of Kotkaklubi, its bank account number in IBAN format and the IBAN (=SWIFT) code of the bank are enough. The same thing when you make a payment to Looduskalender’s account. The BIC number of Danske Bank is the same as the one given for Sampo Pank. You can find the necessary and complete information in Jo UK’s posting:
viewtopic.php?p=482890#p482890

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:16 pm

On 29 Jun 2016, 20:49 star-o wrote:So thank you all, this tiny bank in small town don't know all about money's transferring even they talk together with coffee mugs many times every day. :gathering:
On 29 Jun 2016, 20:53 Sasa wrote:There was no problem in transferring money to Kotkaklubi and Looduskalender. The only
change is that Sampo bank does not exist any more, which is no problem, because IBAN and
BIC are correct.

I did the transfer online and there was no difference to other money transfers. I guess also that it does not cost anything extra since it is done by the new European SEPA standard procedure.

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Post by ame » June 30th, 2016, 12:44 pm

On 29 Jun 2016, 20:59 constant.gardener wrote:I made a donation and now I wonder how I'll be able to see if all went well. Will be here a list next time?
On 29 Jun 2016, 21:25 Jo UK wrote:See your PM.

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