Black Stork Nest in Karula 2019

Cameras Watching over Black Storks nest
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Jo UK
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Re: Black Stork Nest in Karula 2019

Post by Jo UK » June 29th, 2019, 4:55 pm

I agree, Summi. Kati has always been the "frog lady". Karl II likes to fish.

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Liz01
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Post by Liz01 » June 29th, 2019, 5:11 pm

Summi wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 4:38 pm
.......
Sorry, I don't remember who asked what male and what female BS prefer as food. It's clear from today's meals at least on this nest - Kati prefers frogs and Karl II perches. :D
Summi, It was Biker.

Kati prefers lampreys. And later in the season frogs and other amphibians. If no frogs are found, then she brings fish and snakes...
I do not know if it depends on the habitat or the gender :puzzled:

EDIT: What I know is that the females are initially important to the chicks because they are able to find food of adequate size.

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Post by balistar » June 29th, 2019, 5:53 pm

15:11 "Can you see, that we have eaten well ?" :laugh:
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15:12 "Yes, our parents are great, each with his/her specialty" :thumbs:
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Post by Biker » June 29th, 2019, 6:01 pm

:hi:
Summi wrote: ↑
June 29th, 2019, 4:38 pm
.......
Sorry, I don't remember who asked what male and what female BS prefer as food. It's clear from today's meals at least on this nest - Kati prefers frogs and Karl II perches. :D
yes it was me.
by Biker » June 28th, 2019, 2:44 pm
i have another question. ( :rolleyes: )
are there also different preferences regarding food (for themselves) between the sexes at BS?
i read it about White Storks, don't know if it was observed/researched at BS. Does anyone of you know something about this and could please report about it?

perhaps in a quiet/eventless minute (for the storklets)
they studied differences in prefered food of adult WS food for themselves .
(not regarded the food they collect for their offspring; other theme)
so i wondered: is it similar at BS, I probably think so.
Of course the habitat and also the offer is mainly decisive,
as i see now, some of you observed differences already for a longer time and at several BS. regarding the food they bring for their offspring.
but quite possible it is a rather nonsensical question, because there are probably few among us who watch BS while eating. :puzzled: :slap:

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Post by Liz01 » June 29th, 2019, 6:31 pm

18:29 Karl with fish
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after feeding. .very big crop - this time it went fast :laugh:
Image


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Post by Liz01 » June 29th, 2019, 6:49 pm

Biker wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 6:01 pm
......
they studied differences in prefered food of adult WS food for themselves .
(not regarded the food they collect for their offspring; other theme)
so i wondered: is it similar at BS, I probably think so.
Of course the habitat and also the offer is mainly decisive,
as i see now, some of you observed differences already for a longer time and at several BS. regarding the food they bring for their offspring.
but quite possible it is a rather nonsensical question, because there are probably few among us who watch BS while eating. :puzzled: :slap:
There are studies. They killed the black storks and examined the crop and stomach contents.
So they could find out how much fish ect. are in the stomach and crop. It was listed what kind of fish, amphibians, beetles ect.
I do not think that there is a difference in the sexes. The adults eat what they can find. That's what they bring to the nest.
A list of preferred foods of the black storks I placed long ago in the forum.

What they are very reluctant to eat are toads. Even in case of extreme hunger they try to do without toads

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Post by Summi » June 29th, 2019, 7:07 pm

It's a very beautiful combination of colours when a parent feeds - black, white and exceptionally tense red. And this combination is natural and not artifical! I never get tired of admiring it. :nod:

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Post by Gigi » June 29th, 2019, 7:12 pm

Summi wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 7:07 pm
It's a very beautiful combination of colours when a parent feeds - black, white and exceptionally tense red. And this combination is natural and not artifical! I never get tired of admiring it. :nod:
i agree! :nod:

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Post by Biker » June 29th, 2019, 7:13 pm

There are studies. They killed the black storks and examined the crop and stomach contents.
So they could find out how much fish ect. are in the stomach and crop. It was listed what kind of fish, amphibians, beetles ect.
I do not think that there is a difference in the sexes. The adults eat what they can find. That's what they bring to the nest.
A list of preferred foods of the black storks I placed long ago in the forum.

What they are very reluctant to eat are toads. Even in case of extreme hunger they try to do without toads
my interest was indeed explicit the differences between sexes. sxual differences in food preferences were observed in that study at White storks.
there are these differences.
i "see" the couple also as singles without offspring, and have to admit the question does not fit here with a nest with chicks and then growing adolescent storks, which have to be fed up.

sorry for my deviation from the topic - off topic -
about the published results:

Sexual differences in food preferences in the white stork: an experimental study.

http://europepmc.org/articles/pmc5384956

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Post by Gigi » June 29th, 2019, 7:14 pm

Liz01 wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 6:49 pm
There are studies. They killed the black storks and examined the crop and stomach contents.
So they could find out how much fish ect. are in the stomach and crop. It was listed what kind of fish, amphibians, beetles ect.
I do not think that there is a difference in the sexes. The adults eat what they can find. That's what they bring to the nest.
A list of preferred foods of the black storks I placed long ago in the forum.

What they are very reluctant to eat are toads. Even in case of extreme hunger they try to do without toads
very interesting, liz! i can understand trying to do without toads. :mrgreen:

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Post by Liz01 » June 29th, 2019, 8:16 pm

Black storks have a different way of life than white storks. They avoid the humans. White storks live among humans.
It is not possible to differentiate female and male black storks in the field. Ask Urmas. He did not know if he caught Kati or Karl when he tagged him with a transmitter.
So how should one determine what female or male black storks prefer. :puzzled:

Gigi :mrgreen:

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Post by Biker » June 29th, 2019, 8:49 pm

those mentioned questions can get cleared when observing BS with cams,
Differentiation of the sexes is possible here.
- only possible whlie breeding - therefore nothing new results, because all collected food is intended for the kids.
no chance. :banghead:
hm, the more answers, the more questions. eg whether others are interested too. :puzzled:
ok, then i continue to count chicks who fledge :unsure:

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Post by Summi » June 29th, 2019, 10:17 pm

22:15
Did they have a quarrel? No lying side by side tonight but head to tail mode. :laugh:

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Post by Anne7 » June 29th, 2019, 11:16 pm

Poliff wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 10:25 am
Hi, everybody. I saw what was written here earlier about why Karl takes so long to regurgitate food. Seeing how long Karl burps today, and then seeing the fish, it all became clear. Perch is a fish with prickly fins and a dorsal crest.
While Karl a little bit can not digest, it would be a pain to burp the fish. And since storks arrive immediately after a sufficient catch to the Chicks for feeding, then this is all the complexity.
Liz01 wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 11:15 am
I did a video SLOMO and ZOOM. You can see, that Karl II has brought a huge amount of small fishes.
Poliff wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 11:28 am
And this fish is perch.
balistar wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 12:05 pm
Thanks also very much to you, Poliff, for mentioning the perch and remembering on the prickly fins and the dorsal crest.
Poor Karl II, despite the apparent pain, he is so determined not to go away before he could feed his storklets.
Unfortunately, we were able to see on one of the Hungarian storklets this year how dangerous these spiky fins can be or what kind of injuries they can cause.
Hello, everyone :wave:
Many thanks.

We talked about perches and regurgitation last year.
viewtopic.php?p=610987#p610987
Posted by kuhankeittäjä

Black Storks swallow fish in the right direction (head first). If a fish is swallowed backwards (tail first), the fins, gill covers and scales open. The fish will not glide properly.
This is, of course, extremely important with fish that have spikes.

Image
© http://huntergathercook.typepad.com/hun ... -uk-1.html

On the photo, you see a small perch. The dorsal fin is open and you can clearly see its sharp needles. You can also see the sharp point at the end of the gill cover. (opercular which protect the gills)
If the dorsal fin and both gill covers of a perch open while being swallowed backwards, the risk of injury is real. The "needles" hook into the bird's throat.

Here is a theory (a possible explanation) of the difficulties in regurgitation:

During regurgitation, the fish should preferably also come out in the right direction (head first). Theoretically. We see that, in reality, fish is often regurgitated backwards (tail first) by Karl II. Is that the problem?
If a perch comes out in the wrong direction (tail first), dorsal fin and the gill covers will open. The fish gets blocked and cannot (or not easily) be regurgitated. This will undoubtedly be painful.

Logically, a (prickly) fish should be turned into the right direction in the crop, before regurgitation.
Possibly, if the crop is "overfilled", this turning does not work and the fish will resists regurgitation.


As I said, this is just a theory. Does it make sense? :puzzled:
“Clearly, animals know more than we think, and think a great deal more than we know.”
— Irene Pepperberg

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Post by Emotion_ » June 29th, 2019, 11:44 pm

Summi wrote:
June 29th, 2019, 7:07 pm
It's a very beautiful combination of colours when a parent feeds - black, white and exceptionally tense red. And this combination is natural and not artifical! I never get tired of admiring it. :nod:
Exactly 😀

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Post by Biker » June 29th, 2019, 11:54 pm

by Biker » June 29th, 2019, 7:49 pm
ok, then i continue to count chicks who fledge ...
- of course not. :mrgreen:


at white storks >> ...studies have shown that although dimorphism in body size is slight (males are about 12.5% heavier than females), the sexes differ significantly in intestinal length and digestive performance (Kwieciński and Tryjanowski 2009). <<

>>The observed differences in diet between sexes may reflect their different behaviours and needs during their lifetime.<<
Authors: Zbigniew Kwieciński, Zuzanna M. Rosin, Łukasz Dylewski, and Piotr Skórka
Published online 2017 Apr 7. doi: http://dx.doi.org/10.1007%2Fs00114-017-1457-5


Black storks males and females seems equal, but are certainly not. those differences in digestive capacity, as well as there are those differences between WS males and females
requires different food.
we never will experience more about. BS and experimental studies exclude each other.

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Post by Anne7 » June 30th, 2019, 12:25 am

Biker :hi:

Thank you.
It is really interesting that the white stork exhibits clear gender-related differences in food preferences.
This information is completely new to me. (I will read that study.)

It is possible that this also applies to the Black Stork.
It is true that BS live differently from the white storks and that they have a different diet, but physiologically or anatomically the differences are probably not very big.

EDIT: I mean that it is possible that, also in the BS, males and females may have different preferences with regard to food.
It will, of course, be (partly) other food items than in the WS.
“Clearly, animals know more than we think, and think a great deal more than we know.”
— Irene Pepperberg

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Post by Michi » June 30th, 2019, 5:03 am

June 30th

Good morning, :wave:

if one can't sleep it's a good option to watch the storklets at dawn. ;-)
Here some early morning impressions:

03:43 The storklets are still sleeping. Short time later one after the other got up for a PS, a good wing stretch and a bit preening. Then they went back to sleep. Actually it's more a dozing than sleeping; every now and then a head goes up.
Image

04:29 The sun rises.
Image

04:34:43 Sweet preening of the sibling. Short before it was the other way around.
Image

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Post by Michi » June 30th, 2019, 5:04 am

04:34:58 Suddenly breathtaking pictures appeared in front of my eyes. Incomparably beautiful! :loveshower:
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04:35:01 The sun in the background frames the body of the storklet with golden glow ...
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04:35:05 ... and even shines through the storklets feathers. How amazing\stunning is this? :bow: :D
Image

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Post by Michi » June 30th, 2019, 5:05 am

04:35:17 :D
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04:35:25 Nature in all its beauty ... I'm overwhelmed. :)
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