Black Stork Nest 2 2025

Cameras Watching over Black Storks nest
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Liz01
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Re: Black Stork Nest 2 2025

Post by Liz01 »

Anne7 wrote: May 13th, 2025, 6:29 pm ...
I am also almost certain that it was not our female who took the first two chicks out of the nest bowl and then dropped them into the forest.
In my opinion, that BS didn't look like our female, and also didn't have a gap in the right wing. So it was not our male either. So probably it was the intruder.
I agree! :nod: He also dropped the egg.

Are there parallels to the Estonian nest in the past? A strange male threw the female's egg out of the nest. Unfortunately, it was so long ago, and I wasn't a good observer at the time. I'll look for it tomorrow. I only remember because I saw it here this morning too.
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Anne7
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Post by Anne7 »

.
May 14th

Hi everyone :hi:

Just a quick note to report that I won't be able to document for about a week. I need to be somewhere else. Sorry!

Take care!
:wave:
“Clearly, animals know more than we think, and think a great deal more than we know.”
— Irene Pepperberg
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Everglade
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Post by Everglade »

14.05.25

Good morning!

Male BS on nest

10.25 healthy PS
nest fixing, calling a bit and then standig in silence.
Another lonely stork...

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Everglade
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Post by Everglade »

12.19 female bs arrives.
12.42, 12.57 ps by female bird.
Maybe it's the same friendly couple from yesterday?

I'll add some pictures for comparsion.

Image

Image
preening
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Everglade
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Post by Everglade »

14.05.25


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Dobi
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Post by Dobi »

Hello everyone :wave:
Ann is gone and we're losing track of the chronology, and here it's become such a mess that I personally don't understand anything anymore..., but maybe it should be documented, because it's quite strange.
Excuse me for the inaccuracies, I'm using a translator, and I can't upload photos.
Today, as Everglade wrote above, there was a pair in the nest, I have no idea who the male is, he doesn't have the gap in his wing and it was probably our female with the darker beak. They stood there for a long time, preening, courting, the male lay in the nest, dancing from time to time and around 17:05 - the time stamp is not very clearly visible - there was mating. Then they flew away one after the other. Then someone returned for a short while. And around 19:50 the male returned, probably going to spend the night in the nest.
It's all very strange.
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Post by brofasa »

New male Black Stork profile for later comparisons.
Without a ring we can never be sure but hey. At least we got this.
Image

He also has black scaled feet that you can see on this image. He also appears to have really pale feet. Or is that mud?
Image

This male has no gap in the wing, so this must be our previous intruder and now new owner of the nest.

----------------------
9:27 (really difficult to see timestamp) Male begins to sing a song and touches the edge of the nest.
He might see another black stork he does not like or a threat.
Image
Then, he stops and starts working on the nest bowl.

9:42 Male sings again and touches the nest edge multiple times. Then sits down to rest.
10:24 The male stands up and starts singing a his song again, touching the edge of the nest.
10:52 The male begins singing again.

10:53 Healthy ps
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The male continues singing his song and tending to the nest bowl occasionally.

Healthy wings. No gap.
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12:48 the male starts singing enthusiastically.
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He stumbles into the nest :slap:
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12:49 Female joins him in the nest. They are courting.
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Seems to be our female. Same black marking on the beak, same ring around the eyes.
But without an actual ID ring we cannot be sure.

12:25 Male does healthy ps
Courtship continues.
12:31 They are preening and relaxing in the nest. The female preens him while he is sitting.
12:57 Female does healthy ps

13:08 It starts raining. Our storks are resting.
Image

13:32 Male does healthy ps, then sits down in the nest.

13:50 Courtship continues. Beautiful singing between male and female
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13:58 Female goes to the branch and male stands to sing for her. She goes back and joins him again.
Male sits in the nest once again.
Really long courtship.

14:14 Male does healthy ps

14:17 Male wants to start mating dance but the female rejects it.
14:19 Male wants to start mating dance again but the female is still not accepting.
He sits down in the nest instead.

14:32 Female does healthy ps

14:34 Male sits down again and female preens him.
Image

14:38 Male does healthy ps

The female goes to the branch and while at 14:49 the male calls her in vain, at 14:58 it works and she joins him. They sing their song.

15:02 Male does healthy ps

The female repeatedly goes to the branch but comes back when the male sings.

16:41 The female flies away from the branch.
16:46 The male flies away too.

16:49 A black stork flies past the nest from the left.
16:49 The male is back in the nest, singing.
16:50 The female joins him. They sing.

17:02 Successful mating.

17:23 The male wants to start mating dance but the female refuses.
Image

17:24 Female does healthy ps

17:26 The female flies away.
The male follows shortly after.

17:27 the male returns, singing a short song, then flies away again.
17:28 The male returns to the nest, singing.
17:29 The male flies away again
17:31 The male is back again, singing.
17:32 The male flies out again
17:34 The male is back, singing
17:35 The male is out again
17:38 The male is back, singing
17:39 He is out again
17:40 He is back again, singing
17:42 He is out again. This time he went to catch dinner.

Weird light in the camera.
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19:22 The male is back, short song.

Beautiful colors on the neck.
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He preens and does some work on the nest bowl.

21:49 Night vision. He is alone on the nest.
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I wish him all the best for this season.
Everyone likes birds. What wild creature is more accessible to our eyes and ears, as close to us and everyone in the world, as universal as a bird? - David Attenborough
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Askja
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Post by Askja »

15. May 2025
Anne, Liz, Everglade, Dobi, Brofasa :hi: Good morning!

Thank you, Brofasa! :thumbs:

The male spent the night standing in the nest
02:56 he first opened his eye :D
04:33 he wakes up completely, stretches, sings a few notes and does a healthy PS.
05:13 he seems restless, walks around, does a bit nest work and a small PS.
05:14 he leaves the nest. 05:21 He's back. 05:23 Off again.

04:33 Stretch!
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05:?? He's restless, listening
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06:34 snoozing, but keeping an eye on the surroundings
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“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by Askja »

06:35(?) he's back, singing. He is still for a while, rests standing in the nest, but always with a watchful eye to the forest.
06:57 shortly singing and back to resting position.
07:16 healthy PS, then starts preening himself
07:38 he leaves the nest

08:02 the male is back, singing. He does some poking in the nest and watches the forest.
08:14 he steps onto the side branch.
08:20 the female arrives at the nest.

07.21 Preening the other side :laugh:
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08:11 Something itching on the back neck
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08:20 Subservience to the female
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(Sorry, I have to go for now)
“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Askja
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Post by Askja »

My question is Why do you all think this is "our" female, the mother of the previous brood? I have learned from many years following the black storks here that - except for death - couples stay together as long as they can. Is it possible that this time "our" female left her partner for a younger or better abled man, the intruder? This is the more improbable as she has been fighting him badly, even up to the the time we have seen someone (else?) welcoming the intruder heartily. The few outer signs like a darker beak night not be reliable identification marks?

There is also the question of hormones etc.. The system of "our" female should be set to "Raising hatched offspring". Would she, within 2 days, be so completely ready to found a new family with a new partner?
“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by Askja »

(I'm beginning now to prepare reports for 08:20 - 14:00 camera time)
“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by Treia »

Askja wrote: May 15th, 2025, 12:46 pm My question is Why do you all think this is "our" female, the mother of the previous brood? I have learned from many years following the black storks here that - except for death - couples stay together as long as they can. Is it possible that this time "our" female left her partner for a younger or better abled man, the intruder? This is the more improbable as she has been fighting him badly, even up to the the time we have seen someone (else?) welcoming the intruder heartily. The few outer signs like a darker beak night not be reliable identification marks?

There is also the question of hormones etc.. The system of "our" female should be set to "Raising hatched offspring". Would she, within 2 days, be so completely ready to found a new family with a new partner?


Hello :wave:
I'm no expert on these things, but I've been thinking the same thing anyway...
It would seem strange if our female would accept the intruder so soon after all fights.
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Post by Askja »

Treia :hi:

The female has just arrived, preens herself and does a good PS. The male remains in a "kneeling" position, wings tilted upwards.
08:28 the male gets up, does a full PS. Both are preening themselves for a good while.
08:30 mating... attempt, failed.
08:35 mating... success!
08:52 mating... success. They nearly fell when he jumped off.
08:55 he lies down in the nest. Exhausted from his hard work?
08:57 She is preening him. He jumps up when she touches a certain point on his neck. This is the second time that I see this. (This might confirm my observation on the 12th of May: I was sure it was he who had been thrown out by the neck in the big nest fight.)
He settles down again and she is at him with her beak again. A minute later he jumps up again - he must have a very sore place there.

08:29
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08:30 O-o, that wouldn't do at all!
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09:19 another successful mating.
09:37 another mating attempt, failed.
09:43 aaand mating again... success, I think.
09:48 he lies down again but he's getting no rest. She is pretty rough on him with her preening. Then she preens herself for a few minutes and he closes his eyes. But not for long and she is at him again.
09:56 it has become windy and the tree is swaying heavily.

08:35 Yesss!
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09:54 The male is sleepy - and no wonder!
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“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by Askja »

10:15 mating, successful.
10:28 mating attempt, failed. Gosh, that was the 8th in two hours!
10:37 he wanted to mate again, but slipped off.
10:41 mating, success.
10:53 mating? no, she avoids him.
10:59 mating attempt, failed. It seemed that she didn't want to.

10:23 What a beautiful couple!
Image

11:37 mating, successful I think.
11:39 he lies down in the nest and she walks onto the side branch.
Both have done several medium and small PS, perhaps it is time for a restorative meal?

12:19 he gets up and loosens the nest ground a bit. She on the branch does some strange movements with her head and beak - trying to cast a pellet? I don't know. It goes on for a while.
12:20 he lies down again and she steps back into the nest to preen his head.
12:22 another successful mating
12:31 the lady steps on the branch again, he lies down in the nest.
12:49 he gets up, sorts some twigs in the nest and starts singing to her. She comes back from the branch and they sort and sing together for a moment.
12:52 mating, success.

12:20 Something stuck in my throat...
Image

13:04 mating, failed.
13:11 the female walks onto the branch again, male does some nest work, then lies down.
13:23 she is still fighting with something in her throat, or is she catching insects?
13.30 the female takes off from the side branch. The male gets up, looks around and follows her.
13:34 he is back and sings.
14:00 the male still stands in the nest, waiting for his lady to come back. Is he not hungry?

From 08:20 to 14:00 I have seen 14 matings and mating attempts. Only a few failed.

13:04 Fail!
Image

:wave:
“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by Liz01 »

Askia, :hi: thank you so much! :2thumbsup: that doesn't looks bonding for fun. This is a serious attempt at another clutch.

BTW: For me it is "our" female. The male is the intruder. Male with gap in the wing was chased away. Successfully this time, because the female is no longer at his side. Alone he is without chance. That is my assessment of the situation. It's very late for a second brood. We'll see what happens. She's had a tough time. But a second clutch is possible.

19:40 silent arrival by an BS with worn feathers. Beak with dark part.. that should be the female
Image

Image

As long as both habitat owners were breeding, they fought off any intruder. Both fight together, which makes them strong against intruders. The moment the chicks were gone, there was a new situation.
The female's behavior suggests that she prefers the male who is now present. Otherwise, she would have left the nest with her partner.
partly supported by observations by ornithologists and my own observations. And of course, as always, behavior cannot be proven. It is always an interpretation. We are not birds
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Post by brofasa »

Askja wrote: May 15th, 2025, 12:46 pm My question is Why do you all think this is "our" female, the mother of the previous brood? I have learned from many years following the black storks here that - except for death - couples stay together as long as they can. Is it possible that this time "our" female left her partner for a younger or better abled man, the intruder? This is the more improbable as she has been fighting him badly, even up to the the time we have seen someone (else?) welcoming the intruder heartily. The few outer signs like a darker beak night not be reliable identification marks?

There is also the question of hormones etc.. The system of "our" female should be set to "Raising hatched offspring". Would she, within 2 days, be so completely ready to found a new family with a new partner?
Hello Askja! :wave:

The female's behavior appears to be confusing but I think I see some resemblance to a white stork nest I have been watching briefly years ago in Vrchlabí.
There, the male lost his eggs and mate (as in his mate vanished and his full clutch of eggs were rescued), then a new female showed up and he fought her for three days before he finally tolerated her and accepted her as his new mate. But there was plenty inbetween times when the male tolerated the new female on the nest next to him but attacked her as soon as she got too close or made a move he perceived as threatening.

I think this is all related to hormones. Birds are driven more by them than we humans. Hormones tell them when to leave the wintering grounds and migrate back home. Hormones tell them to build a nest, to sing, to find a mate. The sight and physical presence of the eggs shifts it towards broodiness. Then, to take care of the chicks. Now imagine what the hormones do when the pair loses their eggs/chicks? The white stork in question slowly but surely accepted a new mate as his own hormones shifted, although it took time. I think the same thing is happening here but with the female.

The male with the gap in the wing has lost. The female received a non-threatening male at the nest, courting her (he was singing to her and sat down as well, typical courtship behavior). Her shifting hormones probably tell her to respond. Given enough time, like with the white stork male, the female eventually accepted this new male as her mate. If she would lay eggs again, I do not know if that would be possible. I have not observed this with female storks.

Now, I know there are plenty differences between white stork and black stork behavior but they are related closely enough to breed (although the hybrids are infertile), and some of their behaviors are quite similar.
What I wrote here is merely speculation, using my observations of nests and what I know of bird biology. In no way am I saying it is fact. But an interesting thought nonetheless.
Everyone likes birds. What wild creature is more accessible to our eyes and ears, as close to us and everyone in the world, as universal as a bird? - David Attenborough
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Askja
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Post by Askja »

Liz, Brofasa, thank you so much much for your answers and thoughts!
Yes, true, we are not birds and cannot know. There are also several other possibilities which we don't know, for example, she could have been a former partner of this male and he arrived too late in spring.

But now suddenly I am excited, and therefore... please forgive me if I'm wrong :bow:

Liz wrote 8:01 pm:
"19:40 silent arrival by an BS with worn feathers. Beak with dark part.. that should be the female"

THIS is "our" female! I have been searching for worn feathers in the female all day long today, and found none. Because I had memorised this as an ID for the mother of the hatchlings. Now we will see what happens when he comes home. If he kneels down for her, I have been blind all day 8-) :laugh: :D
“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by brofasa »

Let us attempt to keep the chronology.
You are very welcome, Askja. We learn by asking and sharing knowledge with each other. The more questions and discussions there are, the better!

They spent most of their time preening and resting afterwards.

13:30 The female flies away
Image
The male follows shortly after.

13:31 The male returns to the nest and sings. Then leaves shortly after.
13:32 The male flies back into the nest, coming from ahead. He hits his wing into the trunk of the tree as he tries to land. He sings again.
13:33 The male flies away one more time. He is trying to coax the female back into the nest, I believe.
13:34 The male returns once again with a short song.
This time he stays and spends his time with observing his surroundings and tending to the nest bowl.

14:23 The male flies away.
14:29 The male returns with an enthusiastic song
14:30 The female joins him. They sing together.
Image

14:35 Successful mating
14:40 The male wants to start mating dance but the female raised her head, blocking him.
14:41 The male tries to start mating dance but the female is not interested.
14:42 Male initiates mating dance multiple times but the female rejects it.
14:48 Successful mating
14:50 Male begins the mating dance but the female shifts away from him.
14:55 Male tries to start mating dance on multiple occasions but the female raises her head or shifts away from him, refusing.

14:56 The male sits down in the nest, the female nibbles on him.
Image

15:02 Male stands and begins mating dance. The female refuses.
15:05 Successful mating
Afterwards, the male sits down in the nest again and the female preens him.

15:14 The female flies away.
The male sings to try and coax her back.
15:16 The male flies away as well. Dinner time.
Everyone likes birds. What wild creature is more accessible to our eyes and ears, as close to us and everyone in the world, as universal as a bird? - David Attenborough
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Post by Askja »

Ha, he arrives and they sing together... I was wrong. So, sorry for this excitement :slap: :D One way I'm glad, though, because I had feared another fight.
“Animals, like us, are living souls. They are not things. They are not objects. Neither are they human. Yet they mourn. They love. They dance. They suffer. They know the peaks and chasms of being.” (G. Kowalski) Caveat: Apart from this remarkable sentence I do not agree with his philosophies.
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Post by brofasa »

16:34 The male returns to the nest with a modest singing
He goes to the branch.
Beautiful stork.
Image

17:06 The male flies away from there after a bit of preening.

19:40 The female returns to the nest.
Image
She rests and preens. A gust of wind almost blows her off balance.

21:25 The female starts to sing.
The male joins her on the nest and they sing together.

21:28 Successful mating
21:34 The male attempts a mating dance but the female shifts away from him.
21:37 The male repeatedly tries to start a mating dance but the female steps away from him again.
21:40 The male tries to start a mating dance but the female steps away from him.

21:49 Night vision. Both are on the nest.
Image
The male sits in the nest, the female preens on the branch.
Everyone likes birds. What wild creature is more accessible to our eyes and ears, as close to us and everyone in the world, as universal as a bird? - David Attenborough
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